8.08.2007

With subcultures mainly being a boy's game, I've always looked closely to the few females involved as a support group. You would think that with females being about one to every three men (if not less) in subcultures, they would be tight and appreciative to their sisters involved in the game.

Sadly, this is not a reality.

It seems that in the years I've been involved in this subculture, I've seen women become more or so "frienemies" rather than a stable support system to eachother. This deeply saddens me, as I too have seen this first hand. I guess I am perpetually naive to this, or just hopelessly optimistic to find nice women who are looking for sisterhood through music. I am not saying all females are like this, but there are quite a few out there who are.

What causes this? Why does it happen? Who are these females? I'm going to go forward and explain my views and opinions on this subject. These are strictly my opinions based on my own personal experiences so you are more than welcome to disagree.

Although a lot of teens come into a subculture looking to rebel and be non-conformist, they are just joining another form of conformity and rules. These "tribes" have their own sets of rules and dress within themselves. There are usually unspoken rules of how to act, and who holds what seniority. This does vary from subculture to subculture, but they all have the basic skeleton from subculture to subculture.

Those whom have been "in" for the longest usually have the utmost respect, and typically, they feel they have the right to put those younger and less senior "members" in their place. Women have a similar yet very different set of rules. Women cut each other down almost endlessly.

Womens rules in these youth cults are those in the same to men, however, I feel that they are much more harsh. Typically, it all starts out with how you got in. Usually, it's one of the two - you got in on your own will or from your boyfriend. If you got in from your boyfriend, the rest of the local scene usually knows, as you showed up on the arm of Johnny Subculture at a random gig. If this is the case, respect for you is typically next to nothing - even if you truly do become part of the subculture in the long run - guy or not. You'll almost always be known as so-n-so's girlfriend or ex-girlfriend. Men do not have this problem. They do not have to deal with derogatory names such as"oi toy", "scene whore", or something similar to that. This sexism runs rampant from both males and females. This in itself starts vicious cycle of women's roles in youth cults.

Youth cult or not, women tend to run in cliques and groups of friends in which they trust those few friends and hardly anyone else. I often hear young women from every cultural, social, and ethnic background say, "women are such bitches, I can't stand them!"

Although they've made a few friends, what prevents their clique from being "bitches" to each other? Again, youth cult or not - women tear each other down and can be harshly judgmental to each other to their faces or behind their backs. The sport of tearing down other females isn't a pretty one, but it is often played. In my personal opinion, I honestly think women who tear others down for no apparent reason is just a verbal venting of their own short comings and insecurities. To me, those who bash on other people who have not done anything to them are just insecure cowards trying to build themselves up by tearing others down. In the subcultural view, I often think that this happens because some women are not 100% comfortable with themselves and the role they play within a subculture. They often come off as they have the world to prove to others. The "pros" of the bashing game for one whom plays is typically to brag about how many girls they've driven away. This, I think, is a result of the need to be an alpha female.

Socially speaking, a woman with lots of male attention is considered highly desirable - appearances aside. If a female in a niche culture is surrounded mainly by men, logically, she should have plenty of potential mates and attention - boosting her ego, esteem, and popularity amongst males. This makes her an alpha female. Competition gets ripped down without a second thought. Typically, she will do just about anything to keep this status.

This is highly detrimental to the female side of a subculture. Hazing and driving new kids out leaves the scene stagnant and does not allow it to grow or evolve. With the same girls constantly around, this leaves slim options for the males who want to date within the scene. If these girls are single, they will be surrounded mostly by men, and probably have their internal feelings of alpha females pumped up, and will not want new females coming around. Another reason why this can be extremely harmful is that if people within a local scene date amongst each other. With only a few females around dating the men in the subculture, this will typically cause drama. Say, if there were only 6 males and 2 females in a local scene, this would definitely cause trouble. Also, if a female dates amongst the local scene quite often, this can lead her back to being accused of being an "oi toy" or a "scene whore". Even if she didn't get in because of a boyfriend, she can be accused of these things, and her intentions within a subculture can be questioned just because of her dating habits. Most women outside of subcultures don't get called such names when dating around. The dating world for females within subcultural boundries can be dangerous, dramatic, and disheartening. The need to prove that she is genuine and an individual while dating a man in a subculture can cause many issues within herself and her relationship.

I have honestly never understood the "hazing" into a subculture. When I think "hazing", I think of some dumb frat guys putting a new house member through humiliation. What's the point? Isn't that the sort of mentality we wanted to get away from when we chose to stray from the norms of mainstream society? Why do you want to scare away potential new members of a bands, future dj's, or life-long friends? Shame on anyone who participates in these pointless and degrading tactics - male or female.

Having a healthy, thriving subculture relies on having new blood coming in, and often. Driving new people away, believe it or not, has a domino effect within your local town.

First off, driving people away by not accepting them in the local scene or stating that they need to be hazed in makes you come off like a total jerk. Where ever they're from, they'll tell their friend back home (or non subculture friends that are local), "Yeah, I came here and they expected me to do this, that, and the other to hang out with them. Yeah, I know, ridiculous." Honestly, these games make participants look like total childish buffoons and make said person ashamed to be involved in a subculture. Also, this makes you look like an awful example of a subculture. If you're playing these sorts of childish games, you should honestly do some questioning of your personality and how you treat others in general. As harsh as it may sound, I believe it's true. This could also spread around to other places and give your town a poor representation.

Second, the less people you have in your town, the less often bands will come around. Say a fantastic band comes through your town once, but no one shows up. The impression your town will lay on them is that your town is not a money maker. Most bands don't even get guarantees on the road and solely rely on merch sales to keep their tour afloat and stomachs filled with food. If your town has no one going to shows, they'll skip over your town in future tours. Make sense? So, driving fresh blood out of your scene may also eventually drive out touring bands you want to see.

Another thing I've never understood is why older members within a subculture are so demeaning to younger kids. They, too, were once that age. I'm sure they didn't pop outta mama's womb in full subcultural attire with a stellar record collection. They, too had to go through the ins and outs of growing up and discovering who they are, and Im sure they had some embarrassing records in their collection at one point. Being condescending to these kids is downright hypocritical. If they were treated like that when they were younger, they should be empathetic. Treating new kids like they were treated is wrong, and those two wrongs definitely do not make a right. If you truly love a subculture and music, you want it to grow, evolve, and last against the tests of time. Sharing your love of all these things with younger kids who really don't know where to look helps the subculture grow and forms the brotherly and sisterly bond that is so highly idealized. What is the point of hoarding information?

Rarely do you see younger kids coming around these days who are taken in by older members of a subculture with open arms. If just that were to happen, if people could just get off their mighty high horses...they'd see that most slowly dying subcultures would gain new life. Sure, you may think that these kids are dumb and hopeless, but SO WERE YOU! Don't haze them, don't demean them - just be a positive influence. Being an older "brother" or "sister" can be very rewarding!

Younger girls especially need this positive influence to help prevent them falling into all the sexism and gender roles that subcultures dole out. They need to know that it IS okay to be in a subculture and not be sleeping with someone, or constantly causing drama. They need to know that you can be yourself with outside interests from a subculture. Girls in their teens especially need guidance to help their self esteem, identity, and peer pressure issues. I would assume that most of these girls' parents don't quite understand why they are expressing their femininity in a boy's game. My mother thought I was mental. If I had a female to look up to at that age, those years would've been a lot easier.

I hope things change in the future. I would love to see more women reaching out and cultivating a sense of sisterhood amongst themselves instead of breeding jealousy, cattiness, competition, and two-faced behavior. Negative behavior such as the types I've discussed (from males or females) is detrimental to any subculture. Period. It prevents the cultures and scenes from evolving. Why act in such a manner? No one will benefit from it. Acting with class, dignity and grace will never go out of style and will never be looked down upon. Be secure with your place in the sun and don't concern yourself with anyone else's. Honesty, no one has the authority or right to drive someone out of a subculture - seniority or not.

To those whom have a sense of entitlement - think twice first. Your actions will speak louder than your words.

7 comments:

Anonymous said...

Ughhh where to begin about this issue!? Women are vicious to other women, we always have been and just in a subculture its even more intensified. I was lucky enough when I started out I met women like you and my friend Molly that were very encouraging. You would think with something so unique within subcultures we would greet eachother with open arms. So I therefore agree with you about the personal issue thing with these crazed women. It shouldn't be the way it is and its a very sad thing. I think some people are just in this for the wrong reasons. Ughhh. I guess I just embrace the friends I have met through this a hell of a lot. It's all about sisterhood ladies!!!!!!!! - Janelle

Anonymous said...

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THIS 100 PERCENT! before i got into ska like i am now i was very into punk and i just got so rediculously fed up with the scene. everyone demeaning EVERYONE just to gain scene points or whatever. silly punks. i gave up. i never hung out with punk girls, ever. they're just mean! but let me say god bless this ska scene, though little and very third wave. or at least bless the new hampshire ska scene. i'm not too into boston, the shows are getting pretty bad with the moshing. :( anyways. i go to this very small venue called "the sad cafe" for ska nights and let me say, i am so greatful to have it. not too many girls really into ska around here besides me, but the girls that do go to the sad i absolutely adore. we all dance, we all get along, it's wonderful. Another thing i like about the sad cafe is that these ska shows have kids of any age going to them as the venue is run by this very nice old couple and is dedicated to being "family friendly." My friend brings his little brother to shows, we taught him how to dance! I wish it could be like this everywhere.
and on the note of hazing! last summer i shaved my head. what can i say, i had a mohawk, i was sick of it, i was done with my punk stuff. well, i still had bangs so it was a fringe, and all the time people would warn me. like "WAAAH DONT LET A SKINHEAD SEE YOU, THEY'LL CUT OFF YOUR FRINGE, YOU DIDNT EARN THAT" WHAT IS THAT? ITS A HAIRCUT! WHO CARES?! all i can say is the thought of having to EARN a bald head is SCARY.

oh another thing i hate. i go to a punk show to see a band i like and i get endlessly harassed for being "mod" or a "ska kid" and it's just LAME. Just because I bathe daily you assume you arent going to get along with me? silly smelly punks.
anyways, thanks for the article. AMAZING. <3

Anonymous said...

I enjoyed reading this... very positive message. I have no clue now if I should be happy or not that there's no scene in my town.. I don't know anyone else here who is really into my kind of music [who isn't 10+ years older than me].. Still, it's a great read, and it's definitely true to any subculture. which is quite depressing when each goes in that direction to remove themselves from the mainstream, just to end up with the same set of rules and attitude. no matter what, there will be the condescending assholes and the two-faced bitches, but maybe more will read this and actually attain the same mentality you have. oh well, despite those kind of people, there will always be those who are in it truly for themselves and not their image. they just seem harder to find.

--Kyna

Anonymous said...

I enjoyed reading this too..

I never was a nice girl that talk to each one that I see with a chelsea cut. I've suffered a lot with fake subculture friendships, so I'm always in backside.
I prefer to know girls who my friends introduces me than making friends with unknown people. I got a trust problem, so I can't be too friendly so early, but I'm not a rock, I can be friendly if I feel confortable with the person immediately.
I like to be a big sister to people that really wants to know all I can be useful, if I'll talk to the walls I'll keep my mouth shut.
Some girls, specially young girls thoughts that they know everything, and keeps the high pride, and no matter how hard you try to explain the right points, they insists in the wrong ones.
I don't have too much pacience, so I ignore some kids very easiely..
It's a problem and I know that, sometimes i have regrets for myself.
When I was young I had a lot advice, but I never fallow almost no advice. I had to live and learn almost by myself.
Some kids never listen to the old ones...

Natha

Anonymous said...

I really enjoyed this as well. I do agree with everything you said. I guess this happens in all places in the world... You said it all, and I'll just add in my own words that, THERE'S A BIG LACK OF HUMBLENESS around the scene. It pisses me off having to put my head down just because "this person" is around the scene longer than me or whatever. Although I've learned not to do it anymore. I believe my personality is strong, and these types of situations made me mad at myself. It's sad and humiliating, in a way. Instead of making you more excited about it all, it just turns you off, either you wanting it or not. Sometimes it looks like they don't want the scene to grow (and maybe that is a fact); it's like "we will always be the original ones, fuck 'freshcuts'". Sad, sad, sad. Although, if we manage to look on the bright side, these situations make you stop and think about what you really want; if THIS is what you really are. Peer pressure can turn people off and make them say "fuck this". BUT, if they know that, no matter what, this is what they love and want for themselves, they'll say "fuck them". And it's not just because they are older that they deserve our respect. This is something you conquer. Respect and be respected, and if not, shove it up their asses.

Warm greetings from Brazil.

Robert S said...

You make some really great points about the nature of subculture. You've obviously given these issues a lot of thought, which is more than I can say about most people involved (or formerly involved) in "upbeat culture" or any other subculture for that matter. I've been listening to ska and reggae for about 10 years now, and I've always found it important to be able to fully function outside of the scene as well as within it because let's face it, if the music isn't the true inspiration, the whole thing is based on little more than a reason to dress a certain way. I LOVE spinning Jamaican music, going to shows, and generally consuming film, records, and other media pertaining to it, but it's just one of my interests. I don't mean to downplay the importance of community within a subculture (especially because my background tended to greatly clash with it in this case), but you make a lot of good observations about what it takes to be a well adjusted young person. And yeah, that's no easy feat for anybody. These kinds of dynamics are a central theme of that new movie "This is England". I'd definitely recommend checking it out if you haven't already. Anyway, I'm probably almost as intrigued by youth cults and subculture as much as you are, so keep up the ethnomusicological studies and I'll be right there to eat it up. Very nice work.

Get Up Edina! said...

Thanks to everyone who has commented so far - I was weary putting this online in fear of coming off as snooty or as if I was holier than thou. I'm glad those who have commented have not seen it in that way. Your kind comments make me want to write even more about my feelings and views on youth cults. Thanks for reading, and thanks for your patronage!!

-joanna